Stream: t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines

Topic: meeting time and DST


RalfJ (Oct 25 2018 at 11:05, on Zulip):

When is the meeting going to happen next week? If we stick to 1515 UTC, that would move it 1h earlier for me, which is okay. But if e.g. the compiler team meeting does NOT stick to UTC, but shift with DST (but then DST in which state/country? AFAIK not even all US states shift at the same time), that would make the two overlap.

RalfJ (Oct 25 2018 at 11:09, on Zulip):

we could also move to 1615 UTC, which means the time wouldn't change for anyone who goes out of DST this weekend

nikomatsakis (Oct 25 2018 at 15:04, on Zulip):

usually I selfishly anchor everything to the US

nikomatsakis (Oct 25 2018 at 15:30, on Zulip):

seems like the compiler team mtg will stay on US time

RalfJ (Oct 25 2018 at 15:31, on Zulip):

which US time? you have 4 timezones and AFAIK states have autonomy for DST

RalfJ (Oct 25 2018 at 15:31, on Zulip):

i.e., youre not being helpful ;)

nikomatsakis (Oct 25 2018 at 15:31, on Zulip):

for the purposes of this discussion, it is irrelevant, but ok — Boston time :)

nikomatsakis (Oct 25 2018 at 15:31, on Zulip):

I suppose it's technically true that some locales do DST differently

RalfJ (Oct 25 2018 at 15:32, on Zulip):

well it is relevant because when Boston goes in and out of DST might be different than, dunno, New Jersey

nikomatsakis (Oct 25 2018 at 15:32, on Zulip):

basically: the time in the calendar invite

nikomatsakis (Oct 25 2018 at 15:32, on Zulip):

which is presently anchored to New York =)

RalfJ (Oct 25 2018 at 15:32, on Zulip):

I'd like to have your trust in that invite actually being interpreted correctly across DST changes

RalfJ (Oct 25 2018 at 15:32, on Zulip):

but I dont :)

Aaron Weiss (Oct 25 2018 at 15:38, on Zulip):

@RalfJ while it is nominally true that DST is a states issue, the only state that chooses not to do it at present is Arizona. So, there is one precise notion of an "Eastern Time" (and, for that matter, a "Pacific Time").

Aaron Weiss (Oct 25 2018 at 15:39, on Zulip):

(There is not one "Mountain Time" because half the year Arizona's mountain time agrees with "Pacific Time" and the other half it agrees with the rest of "Mountain Time" :wink:)

nikomatsakis (Oct 25 2018 at 15:40, on Zulip):

this stuff makes my head hurt :head_bandage:

RalfJ (Oct 25 2018 at 15:40, on Zulip):

Mountain is... 1 or 2 offset from Eastern?

RalfJ (Oct 25 2018 at 15:40, on Zulip):

see, if you just use UTC offsets you dont have to assume people know US politics :P

RalfJ (Oct 25 2018 at 15:40, on Zulip):

or geograhpy

RalfJ (Oct 25 2018 at 15:40, on Zulip):

or both, actually, it turns out

nikomatsakis (Oct 25 2018 at 15:40, on Zulip):

I think we should abolish all time zones and DST and just have half the world wake up in the night time

RalfJ (Oct 25 2018 at 15:40, on Zulip):

;)

nikomatsakis (Oct 25 2018 at 15:40, on Zulip):

just not my half

RalfJ (Oct 25 2018 at 15:40, on Zulip):

we should use 25h days

RalfJ (Oct 25 2018 at 15:41, on Zulip):

so the half that wakes up at night moves slowly over the globe

Aaron Weiss (Oct 25 2018 at 15:42, on Zulip):

Mountain is... 1 or 2 offset from Eastern?

Mountain is UTC-7 or UTC-6 (DST), but Arizona is always UTC-7. I didn't really specify where they were because it wasn't important besides "Not Eastern Time." :wink:

Aaron Weiss (Oct 25 2018 at 15:42, on Zulip):

Something something, my costal elitism.

RalfJ (Oct 25 2018 at 15:44, on Zulip):

however, US DST is different from EU DST

RalfJ (Oct 25 2018 at 15:44, on Zulip):

we go out of DST this weekend

RalfJ (Oct 25 2018 at 15:44, on Zulip):

you seem to do it one week later

RalfJ (Oct 25 2018 at 15:45, on Zulip):

(or so google said, when I just asked it)

nikomatsakis (Oct 25 2018 at 15:45, on Zulip):

yes

RalfJ (Oct 25 2018 at 15:45, on Zulip):

so I'd still prefer using UTC^^

RalfJ (Oct 25 2018 at 15:45, on Zulip):

for communication

RalfJ (Oct 25 2018 at 15:45, on Zulip):

dont care about what it is pinned to

nikomatsakis (Oct 25 2018 at 15:45, on Zulip):

this is why I prefer pinning to a locale

RalfJ (Oct 25 2018 at 15:46, on Zulip):

I think UTC is the only locale that we can reasonably expect everyone to know

nikomatsakis (Oct 25 2018 at 15:46, on Zulip):

because I don't really know my UTC offsets :) I know the relative offsets to other places...

RalfJ (Oct 25 2018 at 15:46, on Zulip):

like, I honestly dont want to also have to remember when US goes into/out of DST

nikomatsakis (Oct 25 2018 at 15:47, on Zulip):

I agree that makes a measure of sense =) mostly I lean on calendars for this... regardless, it would conflict with compiler mtg I think if we don't leave it as is?

RalfJ (Oct 25 2018 at 15:47, on Zulip):

by leave as is you mean stick with UTC 1515 for one more week and then go to UTC 1415?

RalfJ (Oct 25 2018 at 15:47, on Zulip):

well there is no mtg next week

RalfJ (Oct 25 2018 at 15:47, on Zulip):

so in two weeks it'd still be 1515 or would it be 1415?

nikomatsakis (Oct 25 2018 at 15:47, on Zulip):

whatever the calendar invite says :)

RalfJ (Oct 25 2018 at 15:47, on Zulip):

sigh

RalfJ (Oct 25 2018 at 15:48, on Zulip):

also @Nicole Mazzuca said they wanted a bit earlier

RalfJ (Oct 25 2018 at 15:48, on Zulip):

AFAIK it was for them that we start 1515 and not earlier, so I'd be fine going to 1500

nikomatsakis (Oct 25 2018 at 15:48, on Zulip):

wfm

nikomatsakis (Oct 25 2018 at 15:49, on Zulip):

I do see the logic of UTC — we could move compiler meeting and anchor it to UTC too — I don't care really, just want to do the same thing for both (and have it reflected in the calendar invite).

RalfJ (Oct 25 2018 at 15:56, on Zulip):

yeah it makes sense to do the pinning consistently across rust teams

RalfJ (Oct 25 2018 at 15:56, on Zulip):

and I guess for now that means US\Arizona

RalfJ (Oct 25 2018 at 15:56, on Zulip):

but that means we all rely on our US friends to notify us when the UTC offset changes :)

Aaron Weiss (Oct 25 2018 at 17:23, on Zulip):

It means US/Boston since Boston is the center of the (@nikomatsakis) universe :wink:

nikomatsakis (Oct 25 2018 at 17:33, on Zulip):

confirm :)

avadacatavra (Oct 25 2018 at 20:19, on Zulip):

well it wouldn't make sense to pin on my timezone since i'm half european timezone half west coast time...

nikomatsakis (Oct 25 2018 at 21:11, on Zulip):

see also the discussion in #t-compiler here

nikomatsakis (Oct 25 2018 at 21:11, on Zulip):

which revealed some downsides to both approaches

nikomatsakis (Oct 25 2018 at 21:11, on Zulip):

and did not yet seem to reach a firm conclusion

Last update: Nov 19 2019 at 18:00UTC